CIA warned the US Government about Iraq's claim...

[RonOnGuitar]

Hiya Debbie -



I think you'll find that this doesn't have much "legs" to most Americans - or at least that seems to be the general thinking here. The field of Democrat 2004 prez contenders would be amiss if they didn't try to get some mileage (kilometers?) out of it though, kinda goes with the political territory. But generally, it seems most folks are not getting worked up over the story. There's just no cry of "What? A politician might have exagerated? How shocking!" rising up in the land.



Ron

[debbie mannas]

it sad, the current apathy, when you think of the impact the president of the US has on the world.



We should all be voting the world over, I tell ya.



I think the democrats SUCK for not standing up to this earlier, for not making more of an issue about the elections, for not... arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrgh. They seem to have no convictions whatsoever.



Don't you have any other parties? In India, I've lost count of the number of parties we have. It's a good thing cause it provides a lot of balance - otherwise we'd probably have a hindu fanatic state now.



I'm proud of HK for getting of its behind and protesting. Now that they've got the hang of it, we'll probably see protests left right and centre. urrrk. This place was truly apathetic. As long as people were making money they didnt give a toss. All they ever read are comic books and porn. Walk on the streets and all the newstalls are selling porn mags with semi naked women on em. When there is a book fair, no point going cause its all full of comic books, most of them japanese, and also full of semi naked women. They will stand in queues miles long for Hello Kittys and McDonald collectibles, buy the burgers for the Snoopy and chuck them away.



I hope change is in the air for HK and the US, now that the issues are in the open.

[RonOnGuitar]

hey there!



Y'know for those who are not fond of W here or abroad, things may not be so bad, Debbie. That is, although he was re-elected in a landslide then-President Nixon actually solidified those who opposed him/his policies way back when. Oddly enuf, without someone/somebody to serve as a symbol to rally against, change is often much harder. If policies can come and go with a person, that's not so bad compared to policies becoming institutionalized.



The US used to have Democrats/Liberals who were made up of great substance. (Clinton is ften cited as being more style than substance, by comparison). Roosevelt, Truman, even (Lyndon) Johnson and John Kennedy were all examples of liberal/democratic heavyweights. Unfortunately the modern opposition to the Republicans has become characterized as a kooky hodge-podge of politically correct special interest groups - something far removed from it's appealing older "just folks" makeup. Not much linkage to the 'common man' - or 'common woman' for that matter - and they've lost a lot because of it. That's too bad, because they used to be contenders and made things interesting.



My guess is that if the killing of US soldiers in Iraq goes on and if things don't look good by the end of this year there, you'll see a change in the way Americans are looking to next year & the election. Just as important - maybe even more so - to that election is how the economy will be going - or not going. That was the factor that brought down W senior in '92 even after a very well received Gulf War I. The current problem for the opposition is that none of the Democratic contenders have been inspiring - at least so far. But that could change. A year in politics is like a dozen lifetimes.



yeah, we have all sortsa parties - most of them minor and only attracting the fringe voters. But in my state (Minnesota) our last Governor was an independent, more or less - Jesse Ventura, whose former experience was as a pro-wrestler, lol. (really) He was kinda Libertarian - our current Gov is very much conservative (too much, so, actually). Who knows what the future has in store? Maybe it's just as well we don't know!!



"They will stand in queues miles long for Hello Kittys and McDonald collectibles, buy the burgers for the Snoopy and chuck them away."



Actually, it might not be such a bad idea to ditch the burger and eat the toy instead!!



Ron

[debbie mannas]

I liked Jesse Ventura for his outspokeness, didnt know much of his policies though, but saw him on letterman coupla times. Giant bald guy. Didnt he have some sort of cancer? Why isnt he gov any more?

[debbie mannas]

Quote:

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Actually, it might not be such a bad idea to ditch the burger and eat the toy instead!!

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true enough!

[RonOnGuitar]

hahaha, yes that's him.





I believe he had difficulty with phlebitus - a blood clot forming in the leg due to sitting in long plane flights, I believe he said.



He just didn't run in 2002! I don't know that he would've won again, though. Minnesota used to have a long, long history of being (common sense) liberal. Our best known politician before Jesse 'The Body', would be Hubert Humphrey, who after serving as a mayor of our largest city and Senator for our great state went on to be elected Vice Prez under Lyndon Johnson and ran for Prez himself in 1968, losing to Richard Nixon. Our other Minnesota VP was Walter Mondale, who served under Jimmy Carter and ran for Prez against Reagan in '84 (lost, of course).



Last year was an odd political year here - former Senator/VP Mondale was taken out of mothballs and ran as candidate for Senate from Minnesota as a last minite fill in for Senator Paul Wellstone (very liberal) who lost his life in a plane crash about 10 days before the election. When they (the Democrats) had a memorial service for Wellstone (and wife & daughter, both also killed in the crash), it turned into an unseemly campaign rally that was carried live by both local and national media. Ventura and his wife walked out because of the tone - they had come to just pay their respects. The partisan campaign rally tone had a big impact on the voters, too. Mondale probably would have been elected in the late Wellstone's place, but instead the 'memorial' help enable the Republicans to get a tiny majority in Congress with the election of Norm Coleman, who took Wellstone's seat. Time Mag did a piece on this just after the election -

Fallout from a Memorial -

Did the memorial service for Paul Wellstone cost Democrats the election?





So it was a strange election year, both locally and nationally!



Ron

[debbie mannas]

It was strange, his death. Of course the world hadn't heard of him till he died. but then I started reading about his policies, his passion... he couldabeenacontenda...



all in all a very strange year.



From an objective view far far away, I just dont understand partisanship. Issue biases are one thing, but how can you agree or disagree on the basis that someone belongs to the same party as you? How can you dismiss someone's opinions simply because they are democrat or republican?

[Galmin]

.., a possible scenario:



-Do you like it here, Mr Tenet? Do you like your job?

-Eh, yes sir.

-You want to keep it?

-Of course!

-Ok, this is how you achieve that: you take the heat for the uranium story in the Presidents speech and he will support you.

-He will?

-Sure, mr big likes you. That is he likes you as long as you agree with what we've just discussed.

Quote:

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Bush backs CIA chief



President Bush said today that he remained confident in George Tenet after the CIA director took responsibility for a now-discredited line in the State of the Union address alleging that Iraq was trying to buy uranium in Africa.

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Before





After

[debbie mannas]

These are the guys wanting to bring "democracy" and "freedom" and "justice" to the world. What a joke.



I wonder if this will turn the tables on bush's popularity. I mean if I was a person off the street in the US, I would NOT take Tenet's "confession" at face value. This to me only reinforces the administration's guilt. It is so obvious Tenet's the fall guy (well, we knew that all the time, but I say this if I was hypothetically sitting on the fence). Unfortunately, because of this mea culpa by Tenet they cannot impeach the @#%$. But will he win the next election? America will be in a really sorry state if he does.



These men are leaders of the world. It makes me sick.

[Galmin]

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