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Fallujah finds
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DreamTone7



Joined: 20 Sep 2002
Posts: 2571

PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 3:56 pm    Post subject: re Reply with quote

The King doesn't like it when he's publically found to have no clothes. :ghost

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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 5:57 am    Post subject: Re: re Reply with quote

Hi DT, any news on those turrible Fallujah finds?



Quote:
The King doesn't like it when he's publically found to have no clothes.


?? I'm not the one going on holiday expecting someone else to do my homework.

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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:01 am    Post subject: Re: re Reply with quote

Quote:

It's hard to forget the recent correction the Florida Sun-Sentinel had to issue after the story (June 25, 2006) that screamed:

Murtha says U.S. poses top threat to world peace.


Drudge, of course, was on the job, but so was Keith Olbermann, because Murtha never said anything of the sort.

Correction

A South Florida Sun-Sentinel article on Sunday misinterpreted a comment from U.S. Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., at a town-hall meeting in North Miami.

In his speech, Murtha cited a recent poll, by the Pew Global Attitudes Project, that indicates a greater percentage of people in 10 of 14 foreign countries consider the U.S. presence in Iraq a greater danger to world peace than any threats posed by Iran or North Korea. Murtha said U.S. credibility was suffering because of continued U.S. military presence in Iraq and the perception that the United States is an occupying force.

Before the retraction, conservatives Bill O'Reilly (who claims he's an "independent"), Tucker Carlson and Newt Gingrich parroted the line, with Brit Hume not far behind. Hume and O'Reilly offered corrections, though with caveats.

It would have been much easier just to read the Christian Science Monitor headline (June 15, 2006), which came from a Pew Research Poll: US in Iraq greatest danger to global peace? Much of world says yes, in survey that also shows declining support for war on terror. But that would not have made their case.

You'd think this would have ended it.

But even after the correction, conservative bloggers went after Murtha yet again (July 6, 2006), with Wizbang! challenging people to "watch the whole video and come to the conclusion that Murtha doesn't agree with world opinion." Other conservative bloggers dutifully picked up the post, asking things like What did Murtha really say in Miami, with Outside the Beltway analyzing "the tone of the video," while one conservative blogger blared "Tokyo Murtha," complete with graphics no veteran deserves. BlackFive, winner of a 2005 Milbog award, mimicked Drudge, screaming "Wizbang! Exclusive - Murtha's Comments Exposed".

On June 27, 2006, conservative Newt Gingrich and right-wing talk radio host Mike Gallagher, sitting in for Sean Hannity, teamed up to not only suggest Murtha is "just plain crazy," but to trumpet their Americanism, when the only one between any of them who actually served in the military was Rep. John Murtha. Gingrich said Murtha is just playing politics: "bashing America, and bashing the military, and repudiating everything I've stood for my whole life."

Yet conservatives are aghast when Rep. Murtha tells the truth about House members, prominent conservatives and Vice President Dick Cheney: Nets Lead With Murtha, Highlight His Ridicule of Cheney's Lack of Military Service.

And there's only one reason why: “On military matters, no Democrat in Congress is more influential,” CBS Evening News anchor Bob Schieffer asserted in bucking up Murtha's credentials at the top of his newscast, insisting therefore “all of Washington listened” to him.

By the end of June, 2006, Media Matters had chronicled a long list proving the Republican Party had begun their full out assault on the Democratic Party, with a lot of help from others: Media coverage of Iraq debate steeped in GOP talking points.

But what about the conservative blogs? Michelle Malkin never, ever stops, unless, of course, she gets caught in her anti veteran spin. BlackFive chimes in, calling Murtha the Congressional Cowardice Caucus Chairman. Power Line on "mad Jack Murtha." Expose the Left has lots of links, but it all gets down to Murtha. Captains Quarters does double duty, trying to tie Murtha with Kerry's 1971 testimony before the Senate. Get it? Republicans and Conservatives asks: Who is the real John Murtha? AnkleBitingPundits offers If He Ran For President, Would Murtha’s VP Be Kim Jong Il? Even the usually restrained Right-Wing Nuthouse couldn't resist: OLD SOLDIERS SHOULD JUST FADE AWAY, with his usual all caps (exclamation mark required)! Jeff Goldstein calls Murtha "Chickenlittlehawk," then adds his extra touch: The war in Iraq is right because it is right. Who can argue with that logic?

The Wall Street Journal and John Fund get their licks in too, making sure to offer a "clarification" over the Sun-Sentinel mistaken Murtha quote. Big of them, isn't it? AOL Journal gets in on it too, with "The Murtha Brothers."





Taylor Marsh




Link



have a nice holiday.

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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 10:47 am    Post subject: Re: re Reply with quote

Here's the entire speech on video, I hope you've allocated 20 minutes for listening and 35MB for storing the file



in case you've forgotten, this is what you're loking for:



Quote:
Elizabeth Baier’s opening sentence:



American presence in Iraq is more dangerous to world peace than nuclear threats from North Korea or Iran, U.S. Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa., said to a crowd of more than 200 in North Miami Saturday afternoon.”




Now try to spot this while remaining intellectually honest. Good luck!

Edited by: Galmin  at: 7/11/06 13:46
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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Apropos-To-Murtha Reply with quote

Oh, is it ok to say that the The Middle East "road map" is "in tatters" now, or will such a statement conjure L. Brent Bozell III out of nowhere distributing brandings for liberal bias?



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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 7:35 am    Post subject: Here comes the swifties Reply with quote

“I called my buddies in the anti-Kerry movement from 2004”
“I will do my best to ‘swift boat’ John Murtha”


-Larry Bailey

http://murthamustgo.blogspot.com/2006/08/fever-swamp-at-fever-pitch.html
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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Mon Oct 30, 2006 11:08 am    Post subject: Re: re Reply with quote

ans wrote:
Initially you were 'saying' it, but by the last reiteration you were obviously citing it.

<p></p><i></i>

Like in, uh, CITING A POLL?

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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Foxnews: "I think it's a smear campaign. You're using the swift boat techniques. I really think it's shameful".

"FBI Tape Reveals John Murtha's Role in Abscam Scandal"

And what did the FBI Tape reveal? That Murtha didn't take any bribe.


Here's the "Swift Boat"(I am quoting FoxNews here) job by David Holman from the American Spectator


Sources on "Swiftboating John Murtha"
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Answerrraire



Joined: 13 Nov 2010
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Sat Nov 13, 2010 9:55 pm    Post subject: so THERE you are!! Reply with quote

THE FAILED ATTEMPT TO SWIFTBOAT ELIZABETH BAIER
Part One

"Swiftboating is American political jargon for an ad hominem attack against a public figure, coordinated by an independent or pseudo-independent group, usually resulting in a benefit to an established political force. Specifically, this form of attack is controversial, easily repeatable, and difficult to verify or disprove because it is generally based on personal feelings or recollections." -- Wikipedia


* * *


Hiya, Galmin! Yeah, vacation was nice, spent a few weeks in the Bahamas on Daddy's dime (Mumsy's b-day) then back to the states w/the gals for a tour of MLB parks (fun!) but intellectual honesty prevails upon me to point out that, in those heady days since you professed not to give a damn, while we were relaxing in the sun, nursing tall cool mezcals, you were busy posting additional posts re 'turrible' Elizabeth Baier's alleged 'swiftboating attack' on poor John Murtha. In fact, evidence suggests you returned to edit those posts, indicating that, in reality, you DID give a damn. :-O

In light of this curious development, may we conclude that, back when you touted your inablilty to give a damn, you were somewhat out of touch with reality vis-a-vis your true ability to give a damn? Might we say you were . . . ahem . . . wrong?

Steeeeeee-RIKE ONE!


Pathology aside, let's get down to business. Here's Elizabeth Baier's opening sentence:

“American presence in Iraq is more dangerous to world peace than nuclear threats from North Korea or Iran, U.S. Rep. John Murtha, D-Pa. SAID TO A CROWD . . .”

* * *

Now, compare her opening sentence to Murtha's actual words, words he SAID, mind you . . . TO A CROWD:

"Everyone of our allies think that the United States being in Iraq is more dangerous to world stability and world peace
. . . they think its more, UH, WE'RE MORE DANGEROUS TO WORLD PEACE THAN NORTH KOREA OR IRAN."

* * *

Detail how a comparison of the two sentences convicts Ms Baier of 'swiftboating'. Where's Murtha's reference to his 'citing of the illustrious Poo poll(sic?)'? Why, it's MIA! In the absence of any reference to a 'Poo poll'(sic?) can you blame Ms Baier for thinking that the words Murtha said reflected his opinion?

Of course not. Not if you wish to retain any intellectual honesty. You've excused 'lowsy journalism'(sic) in the past, even on this very thread have you done so. What was your specific problem with poor Ms Baier, that you couldn't excuse her 'turrible' faux pas of misplaced quotation marks as just another case of lousy journalism?


Galmin: "Trying to make people believe that Murtha had professed his opinion that the U.S. was more dangerous to world peace than North Korea or Iran is indeed an attack."


How was it an attack? Did Ms Baier confess she intended it to be an attack? Has anyone granted you the authority to pass judgment on Ms Baier's intentions? Nope. Basically, you and those others who attempted to convict poor Ms Baier of 'swiftboating' needed everyone else to accept that even though Murtha cited it, he didn't really believe the Poo poll(sic?), and, speaking of intellectual honesty, where would Murtha's intellectual honesty be hiding if he went around citing polls he disbelieves?

FOUL BALL! Strike two.

* * *

Kooky conservatives circled like buzzards:

". . . asking things like 'What did Murtha really say in Miami' (and) analyzing "the tone of the video"

Oooh, wondering what he really said, and analyzing the tone of the video . . .such nasty Swiftboating there, eh? NOT.

* * *

"graphics no veteran deserves"

Graphics NO veteran deserves?

Calley was a veteran. So was Oswald. So is Donald Rumsfeld. Are THEY deserving of unflattering graphics or would the 'swiftboat-criers' swarm out in all their strident force to defend them? Methinks not Mesmells empty rhetoric.

* * *

And the accusations of swiftboating continued:

" . . . Murtha's Comments Exposed".
Owie! Wouldn't want to expose dude's comments, it might embarass him. Would embarassing him by exposing his comments constitute 'swiftboating'?

"Gingrich said Murtha is just playing politics"
Swiftboating?

"The Wall Street Journal and John Fund get their licks in too, making sure to offer a "clarification" over the Sun-Sentinel mistaken Murtha quote."

Suddenly a clarification is a 'lick'? heh

THIS is a LICK:

"Chickenlittlehawk."

lol

Yes indeed, That one's low and outside. Ball One. The count stands at 1-2

Humerous licks have historically been characterized as 'satire' but lately characterized by the SLF as 'swiftboating'. The SLF is quite adept at the hysterics (i.e. "TheWallStreetJournal clarified a mistaken quote!!! SWIFTBOATING!!! SWIFTBOATING!!!")

From Wikipedia:
"Specifically, this form of attack is controversial, easily repeatable, and difficult to verify or disprove because it is generally based on personal feelings or recollections."

The personal feelings of kooky conservatives aside, when 'misinterpretation' was proclaimed by TM, all but the most 'lowsy' of them issued retractions. Within days, if not hours, TM was given the benefit of the doubt and, as per his wishes, he was left to present the world the confusing impression that, although he cited the Poo poll(sic?) he actually disagrees with it.

So again, pathology aside, retractions were duly issued and TM was given the benefit of the doubt. Where's the 'swiftboating' again? Unless you're claiming that TM 'swiftboated' himself, it all comes back to poor Ms Baier and a pair of missing quotation marks.

How can you retain any intellectual honesty if you simultaneously excuse Murtha's missing Poo Poll reference but not Ms. Baier's missing quotation marks?

FOUL BALL! - the count remains 1-2

Anyhoo, being possibly the only individual left still attempting to convict poor Ms Baier of 'swiftboating', but instinctively aware that this charge was specious, hung on the flimsiest of hooks, based upon nothing but your own opinion of Ms Baier's motives, you then oddly claimed to Dreamtone that producing the evidence to support this sophistry was MY homework!

Well WHIFF, dude! Strike Three.

Time to hustle yourself back to the dugout and put on some clothes, the Cubbies are coming to win the World Series in 2011 and you'll want to look your best, eh?

Regards, Ans

P.S.I didn't author the original 'Apropos-To-Murtha' post. I simply cited it to, say, illustrate a point-- that readers of REASON magazine think enough of Murtha to consider him worthy of mention. Using YOUR criteria, it doesn't matter whether or not the content of the poll (er . . . post) is accurate or coughed up by Bin Laden himself. All that matters is whether I authored it or cited it.



About Larry Bailey:

Larry Bailey retired from the U.S. Navy in 1990 after a 27-year career as a SEAL officer. His career included duty in the USA and in Panama, Bolivia, Scotland, Colombia, Vietnam, and the Philippines.

He is a graduate of Armed Forces Staff College and the U.S. Army's Foreign Area Officer School. He holds an undergraduate degree in History from Stephen F. Austin State College in Texas and a master's degree in Education from East Carolina University.

He is a free-lance consultant and writer on military affairs and has been published numerous times in the national press.

His most significant military assignment was as Commanding Officer of the Naval Special Warfare Center, where all Navy SEALS undergo basic and advanced training.

He is a decorated Vietnam veteran and a sub-specialist in both Latin American-and European politico-military affairs.

He has also taught middle-school History and Language Arts.

In 2004 he was President of Vietnam Vets for the Truth, which sponsored the Kerry Lied Rally on Capitol Hill in Washington.

He and his wife Judy, who teaches middle-school Language Arts, live in eastern North Carolina.

If he intends to swiftboat Murtha, well he's an American, that's his prerogative, nay- privilege. If all he wants to do is THREATEN to swiftboat Murtha, that's cool too. He doesn't need to castigate poor Elizabeth Baier in order to do so. Neither do you.

. . .

We used to give the little kids a strike four so as not to hurt their feelings. Yep, this place sure has turned lively since Mr. Burn took your advice and banned anonymous posting . . . heh: STRIKE FOUR

All the best
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Galmin
The King has spoken!


Joined: 30 Dec 2001
Posts: 1711

PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yees, do you always take four years to answer a question with not answering the question?

All the smoke and mirrors aside: Baier misrepresented what Murtha said. The soundbite (the entire speech) has been linked to this thread for years, so there is no denying that fact.
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answerrairre



Joined: 08 Aug 2023
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2023 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Galmin wrote:
Yees, do you always take four years blah blah blah . . .


Sometimes longer. No smoke, no mirrors, no unanswered questions, only your quaint attempt to convict poor Ms Baier of 'swiftboating' while instinctively aware that the charge is specious, hung on the flimsiest of hooks, based upon nothing but the opinion of you, some guy on the internet. Yees yourself

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